Kirpans are ok under 2 inches , Above 2" they are weapons

[YVR Man]

Pointed comments on the kirpan: “above all a religious symbol”
by John Geddes on Friday, January 21, 2011 11:47am -

My colleague says I was “sowing nonsense” when I wrote that the Supreme Court of Canada “found that the kirpan is a religious symbol, not a weapon.” He says the court found no such thing.

Here’s what Justice Louise Charron said in that 2006 decision on the question of whether she regarded the kirpan as a weapon or as a religious symbol, in the dispute between a Montréal school board and a Sikh student:

“Much of the [school board's] argument is based on its submission that:
the kirpan is essentially a dagger, a weapon designed to kill, intimidate or threaten others’. With respect, while the kirpan undeniably has characteristics of a bladed weapon capable of wounding or killing a person, this submission disregards the fact that, for orthodox Sikhs, the kirpan is above all a religious symbol.”

After that, as I read her, Charron considers the kirpan throughout as as symbol rather than a weapon. On claims that the kirpan is “by its true nature, a weapon,” the judge writes, “These assertions strip the kirpan of any religious significance and leave no room for accommodation.”

She touches on analogous arguments about whether Muslim girls should be allowed to cover their heads for religious reasons if other students aren’t allowed to wear hats in class to look cool.

“To equate a religious obligation,” Charron writes, “such as wearing the chador with the desire of certain students to wear caps is indicative of a simplistic view of freedom of religion that is incompatible with the Canadian Charter.”

To say, then, of a Muslim’s traditional headwear, “It’s a hat,” would be to offer definition empty of significance, even if not literally wrong.
Similarly, to declare of the kirpan, “It’s a knife,” is as accurate as it is meaningless.

What the judge was driving at, I’d say, is what the kirpan is “essentially” or “above all” or in its “true nature.”
So, I’ll give you this much: It would have been more precise for me to add a couple of adjectives, and say that the court found that the kirpan is above all a religious symbol, and not essentially a weapon when it is worn as a symbol , larger than 2" it is a potential weapon. Just as Christians do not carry 10 ft crosses around their necks , why should full size Kirpans be carried if they are just to be used as a symbol of faith.
The size matters as a small kirpan cannot ever be used as a weapon , but still counts as a symbol..

Comments ???

[Brutus]

No comment...tl;dr

[Fenton Hardy]

I always carry a knife with me. You never know when you might need it.

[YVR Man]

No comment...tl;dr

Kirpan Kerfuffle
by Martin Patriquin on Wednesday, January 19, 2011 10:51am - 235 Comments
So a few Sikhs try to walk into National Assembly…

It’s a terrible joke if only because the punchline is so damned obvious: said Sikhs go through the metal detector, which goes off because of the ceremonial daggers on their waists, one of the fellows holds a press conference as a result, the (anonymous) brain trust at our august national newspaper blames Quebec, Quebec media pushes back and–voila!–a made-in-Canada scandal. And it’s not even noon yet. Why do people even get out of bed?

There are two important thing to remember here:

Reasonable accommodations, a phrase that has become so catch-all so as to be essentially meaningless, go both ways.

That is to say, if a person wearing religious garb sets off a metal detector, there should be some understanding on the part of that person that a) the metal detector is there for a reason; and b) they don’t lose an ounce of their religiosity if they remove that object for the purposes of public safety–especially if they are doing so to testify in the name of religious freedom.

[What The Duce!]

Sikhs can take a long hard suck! If they dont like it they can move back to their fucking golden temple!

[Salty Dog]

Sikhs can take a long hard suck! If they dont like it they can move back to their fucking golden temple!

So you have heard of this Golden Temple...where hundreds of helpless Sikh men,women and children were machine gunned by a white Officer.

[What The Duce!]

so?

[What The Duce!]

its called pop control

[br]

So you have heard of this Golden Temple...where hundreds of helpless Sikh men,women and children were machine gunned by a white Officer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Blue_Star

The Indian Army stormed the Golden Temple on the night of 5 June under the command of Kuldip Singh Brar. The forces had full control of the Golden Temple by the morning of 7 June. There were casualties among the army, civilians, and militants. Miltant leaders Bhindranwale and Shabeg Singh were killed in the operation.[19]

Operation Blue Star coincided with a Sikh annual festival. Pilgrims, including the elderly and children, were trapped inside the temple when the operation began and many were wounded and killed as a result.

[br]

more on the GT...

On 23 April 1983, the Punjab Police Deputy Inspector General A. S. Atwal was shot dead as he left the Golden Temple compound. The following day, after the murder, Harchand Singh Longowal (then president of Shiromani Akali Dal) hinted at the involvement of Bhindrawala in the murder.[27]

The Golden Temple compound and some of the surrounding houses were fortified. The Statesman reported on 4 July that light machine-guns and semi-automatic rifles were known to have been brought into the compound. On 1 February 1984, reliable sources have proof that Bhindranwale had suggested to that motorcycles and arms should be purchased on a mass scale for killing members of the hindu and non sikh community.[29] Bhindranwale angrily responded to the allegation, saying "nothing is more incorrect".[30]

Time magazine reported (about Amritsar) that:[31]

"These days it more closely resembles a city of death. Inside the temple compound, violent Sikh fanatics wield submachine guns, resisting arrest by government security forces. Outside, the security men keep a nervous vigil, all too aware that the bodies of murdered comrades often turn up in the warren of tiny streets around the shrine."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Blue_Star

[What The Duce!]

a long history of shit disturbing

[Gunta]

I have no problem with them carrying their aladin swords, I have a problem with their should be deported, wannabe, entiteld, fuckwad children carrying guns though

[weebles]

hmm then by all odds it should be ok for all students to carry a 2" swiss army knife if the wish too.

it is not a weapon IMO either it is also a handy tool and has many uses

I mean I bet alot 16/17 year olds can use it to open beer bottles and un-cork wine on lunch break and use it to file their finger nails while in class drunk.

it also has scissors and well everyone knows scissors are always handy.

[What The Duce!]

in the old days when I was a teen we used the seatbelt buckle on our pickups to pop the caps off beer bottles before they had twist offs

[Shaun]

This is one reason why we need to have handgun ownership

[worriedman]

So you have heard of this Golden Temple...where hundreds of helpless Sikh men,women and children were machine gunned by a white Officer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Blue_Star

The Indian Army stormed the Golden Temple on the night of 5 June under the command of Kuldip Singh Brar. The forces had full control of the Golden Temple by the morning of 7 June. There were casualties among the army, civilians, and militants. Miltant leaders Bhindranwale and Shabeg Singh were killed in the operation.[19]

Shahbeg Singh was hardly a militant. He was a Major General(third highest rank in the Indian Army just below the chief of Army and Lieutanent) in the Indian Army. He fought in every battle that the Indian army participated in during his time as a serviceman. He devoted 12 years of his life to continuous service for the Army. He played a major role in liberating Bangladesh from the Pakistan Army by training the Bangladeshi freedom fighters on the orders of the Indian Army. He was also fluent in six languages and was an instructor at the prestigious Joint Services Wing of the Indian Military Academy.

However, even after a brilliant military career he was discharged from Indian Army without court martial or trial one day before his retirement, thus losing his pensions. The provision under he was discharged has been NEVER used in the British Army and this was the first case of its use. Military never gave any explanation of it and Singh took his case to the civil courts, but the CBI(Fbi like wing of the Indian Govt) kept delaying the witnesses and humiliated him for 5 years.

Please dont term him as a militant. The mad women and then prime minister of India Indira Gandhi(only prime minister in the history of India that invoked emergency rule and ruled as a dictator) was the one that manipulated the situation.

I get worried when lack of knowledge breeds ignorance.

[What The Duce!]

Sikhs can suck my nutsack, and feel free to catch the next train back to Fuckoffityland or preferable the next plane back to India "one way"!

[Oscar Mayer]

what is it with you knot heads? I have a pocket knife with me all time

[Oscar Mayer]

YVR Man wouldn't know a kirpan if he found it in his sister's lunch box.

[worriedman]

Sikhs can suck my nutsack, and feel free to catch the next train back to Fuckoffityland or preferable the next plane back to India "one way"!

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes ... eral-trade

I just hope they dont say the same thing to Canadians operating in India.......let's learn to co-exist shall we?


Plus, if it makes you feel any better -

Sikhs = 2 percent of India's population.
Baptized Sikhs(one that carry the blade) = presumably 2 percent of Sikh population.

[heinzy]

[...]
I get worried when lack of knowledge breeds ignorance.

Indeed , justifiedly so!

Even more worrysome is institutionalised ignorance.

The latter is scalable in terms of thousands killed.

[9 incher/160 IQ]

I always carry a knife with me. You never know when you might need it.

I am never without a quick flick knife and small pepper spray ready to use in a second. One in each front pants pocket. When I am wearing a jacket I put them in the jacket pockets. In a second I will have the pepper spray in one hand ready to go and the knife open in the other hand ready to stab and slash. I also sometimes have a solid throwing knife in a holster on my belt. I believe it is legal. I have never been stopped for it.

[9 incher/160 IQ]

In my condo I always have my guns and battery powered chainsaw at arms lengths away from me.

[Blurt]

YVR Man wouldn't know a kirpan if he found it in his sister's lunch box.

[Seamajor]

Bows and arrows are the way to go. Slingshots second. Silent and deadly

[7.83 Hz]

Non-issue. Pretty much anything can be used as a weapon if you're committed enough.

[Sargent Smellibitz]

Non-issue. Pretty much anything can be used as a weapon if you're committed enough.